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Salango's avatar

Man, I miss out on that conversation. (Substack comments section is not really that text-friendly)

I have a lot to say about this, since this hits many vectors that I have explored for years…

So, let me start with this from MB

*2. Argues that recognizing the existence of a “common enemy” helps maintain “unity” in a group.*

This is factually truth, we are hardwired for this. Max talks about this on the book The Social Singularity.

“As science journalist Sharon Begley points out, we team up with people according to “whether they are likely to be an ally or an enemy.” That illustrates how tribal we are. We are wired to be divided.” https://www.pnas.org/doi/10.1073/pnas.251541498

But I would like to bring forward a psychological and sociological interpretation of this method that is creating Unity through Division.

A long time ago I read this from the book “The Loneliness Epidemic” by Teal Swan. “When you want to create certain degree of closeness and connection with someone you can do it at the expenses of a third person, you can start to trash talking on their back (of the 3th person). Once you have a secret with this second person, by necessity, that third person is being excluded, creating a sense of closeness between you and the second person”. This is not the exact quote but I bring it here because, at it’s core, it’s creating unity through division. (Something I want to elabore further later)

Now I want to go back to point 1 by MB.

### 1. Believes it's important to identify adversaries who manipulate systems to take advantage of others—especially as so many seem unaware of this.

I agree 100%. And I say it for reason… here is a quote I stumble upon on TikTok, it caused me to have a few minutes of existencial crisis while processing it… Take it easy.

**“The idea that vengeance against evil makes you just as bad as the evil you are taking up arms against feels very much like something the bad guys would make up and spread across popular culture to make sure we don't shove their head in a guillotine, just saying”**

So... We might be dealing with a massive psy-op directed by sociopaths for centuries to keep the rest of the world from taking revenge against them...

(Check the video "The world’s biggest problem? Powerful psychopaths." | Brian Klaas)

https://youtu.be/BJIOLTMitK4?si=4qXiao0wcjhovlYl

---

Whether we are being bamboozled by a psy-op or not, I see sociopathic behavior as deeply destructive to social orden a cohesion. It just happens to be that 4% of the world’s population happens to be born with that “trait”. (I’m just recalling, not sure of the actual number but Jordan Peterson talked about it. “Dark Triads”…)

Sadly, the social system/social technology called POLITICS, when used at larger scale than the Dunbar number, brings forth the worst out of people. It turns them into Machiavellians and sociopathic.

So, we need to do something with them, at least in big cities. Creating social systems that decentralized power and don’t allow this kind of people into the higher echelons of power. I think destroying single point of convergence might destroy the incentives that attract this type of people. Using an AI to circumvent the need to have someone in charge. Rules without Rulers

### 5. Believes ignoring the perpetrators of injustice is wrongheaded and that our adversaries are neither imagined nor contrived.

We might even need to "Hang 'Em High" so we can get the message straight. THIS BEHAVIOUR IS NOT ALLOWED HERE. Full French Revolution mode.

But I’m just digressing now.

Let’s bring it all back to the “enemies” framework. I have stumble upon the same answer in 3 different ways. Hinduism, Adler and Anime

1. **“Tat Tvam Asi”** is the famous expression of the relationship between the individual and the Absolute. As there where no division between all of us and Existence, so… how is it possible that you have an enemy?… This is a whole rabbit hole in itself. I will just leave it there for a while since this answer is taking me an entire day (crazy)

2. Chapter "ALL PROBLEMS ARE INTERPERSONAL RELATIONSHIP PROBLEMS" (Page 60) and “LIFE IS NOT A COMPETITION”

This is something I found reading "The Courage to be dislike" by Ichiro Kimishi and Fumitake Koga. The book is a dialog that explores Alfred Adler’s ideas on psychology. And that idea is a mind-being one. I still struggle to accept it. I guess that’s why Bard’s says that is hard to think in relational-terms. Now I will just bring this extract here. It's from page 80

"> PHILOSOPHER: When one is conscious of competition and victory and defeat, it is inevitable that feelings of inferiority will arise. Because one is constantly comparing oneself to others and thinking, I beat that person or I lost to that person. The inferiority complex and the superiority complex are extensions of that. Now, what kind of being do you think the other person is to you, at that point?

>YOUTH: I don’t know—a rival, I guess?

>PHILOSOPHER: No, not a mere rival. Before you know it, you start to see each and every person, everyone in the whole world, as your enemy.

> YOUTH: My enemy?

> PHILOSOPHER: You start to think that people are always looking down on you and treating you with scorn; that they’re all enemies who must never be underestimated, who lie in wait for any opening and attack at the drop of a hat. In short, that the world is a terrifying place."

Now, I have lived that hell. Exactly as the philosopher described. When I moved out to a bigger city, the whole world became my enemy. I was not only in a new land, people there where hostile and self-centered mostly. (Peru, or shall I say Lima, has a problem called the law of the “más vivo”. It’s like getting away with a little cheating first or will be the last loser who’s everyone’s taking advantage of)

So, this brings me to Moloch and multipolar traps, I’m not sure if MB or KC are aware of this concept but it’s quite powerful. Liv Boeree and Daniel Schmachtenberger had interesting conversations around this topic. The main work was actually developed by Scoot Alexander. “Meditations on Moloch”. (I’m pretty sure we all know this one right?)

Heck. I sense Moloch is the force behind every single societal issue we have right now.

3. “You don’t have enemies. The truth is… that nobody has them. Nobody in this entire world deserves to get hurt”

This a quote from an anime called “The Vinland Saga” and has turn into a meme on the internet. But once considered along with the whole narrative. You are kind of force to recognize that war will never end unless we stop seeing each other as enemies. I highly recommend you to watch it. It’s a cathartic experience

https://youtube.com/shorts/q-HthlYL2RU?si=W92syl5c7DKH8BFN

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/4Fux4il_bXM

But this then raises the question of who strikes first is the one who wins…(finite game) and an arms race start again, leading to never ending conflict.

Moloch rears his ugly face again.

So… How do you disolved animosity in the world? I will give KC kudos for this. Dispensing animosity is a Shamanic practice.

I would agree with argument 5 too. No movement’s has been successful to sell something in the negative. Being ANTI anything would probably never works because you are not standing in favor of anything. You are just “against” something. (I recall Bard and Sweeny talking about this creation of new “abject” towards which you can direct you hate and maybe realize your hatred by killing that sacrificial lamb. Julia Kristeva? I need to read more. René Girard’s scapegoat also comes to mind)

I think moral opprobrium only works on those who are more “Logos” oriented. Those who follow rules and understand their importance.

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Leonardo Radomile's avatar

With respect, I do believe the dialogue misses the more profound issue. It is a discourse in the confines of polite Western conversation. The real issue is the existence of evil and how to deal with it. Since Genesis, Dante, Chaucer, Shakespeare, Milton, et al, our culture has understood this. Life should be, and is at its best, a free, creative, wonderfully rewarding experience where we continually contribute to each other's lives. Nonetheless, there are always the Maos, the Hitlers, the Ayatollahs and others that must be born in mind and contended with. They never go away. We will always have enemies that must be dealt with in an adversary manner, unfortunately in some circumstances using methods as brutal as their own. Evil exists and must be confronted.

I do not wish to make a mountain out of a molehill but even in our more civilized civic and political discourse a dichotomy can be seen to exist. Take the current political dialogue where those on the hard left are committed to destroying, not just defeating, their opponents. They are adversaries, plain and simple, and very dangerous ones at that.

Sometimes positive change involves eliminating a clear and present danger.

Best wishes,

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